Admissibility of LiDAR in the Courts today

To chat about anything else.
User avatar
landmeterbeuckx
V.I.P Member
V.I.P Member
Posts: 1615
Joined: Tue May 01, 2012 5:19 pm
11
Full Name: Lieven Beuckx
Company Details: Studiebureau Beuckx
Company Position Title: Owner
Country: Belgium
Linkedin Profile: Yes
Has thanked: 183 times
Been thanked: 548 times

Re: Admissibility of LiDAR in the Courts today

Post by landmeterbeuckx »

LPaulCook wrote: Mon Oct 01, 2018 1:51 am
Thanks Shane for pointing me to learn about "File Hash". I found a simple Windows based free software for generating the Hash code for any document or Folder. That's a great way to be sure that a backup copy of my work or a transferred copy is "exactly the same" as the original. What a great way to prove if a file is "exactly" the same as the file I sent opposing counsel or anyone later on.
This could be very helpful in any type of digital delivery of my work, not just forensic work...
Here's where I found this Hash program: https://quickhash-gui.org/download/quic ... 2-windows/

Interesting stuff. I didn't know it existed but know some implementations for my business, like sending dwg's to contractors or engineers, ...
LSBbvba
Surveying services - 3D Laserscanning
Tel : +32477753126
www.lsbbvba.be
[email protected]
DavidL
I have made 90-100 posts
I have made 90-100 posts
Posts: 91
Joined: Thu May 28, 2015 1:11 pm
8
Full Name: David Lander
Company Details: Thames Valley Police Authority
Company Position Title: Crime Scene Surveyor
Country: UK
Linkedin Profile: Yes
Has thanked: 19 times
Been thanked: 2 times

Re: Admissibility of LiDAR in the Courts today

Post by DavidL »

So far I haven't had any issues getting my lidar-based products shown in court. However I generally produce presentation style material where there is liitle that is contentious. I focus on 'telling the story' and contextualising events. I imagine if you're doing something like blood spatter, bullet trajectory or crush analysis, whereby you are using the data to form an opinion and make conclusions, then you would really need to cover yourself fully.
User avatar
ddustin
V.I.P Member
V.I.P Member
Posts: 956
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2011 9:28 pm
12
Full Name: David Dustin
Company Details: Federal Bureau of Investigations
Company Position Title: Visualization Information Specialist
Country: USA
Linkedin Profile: Yes
Location: Quantico, VA
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 11 times
Contact:

Re: Admissibility of LiDAR in the Courts today

Post by ddustin »

Now Scans are Hashed at the source on all the S70, M70, S150 and S350 scanners.
There is nothing to enable, just make sure you have the latest firmware (6.3.1XXX).
Nothing to remember to do.

We've got some training videos on it if your interested.

David
Director of Industry Solutions | Public Safety
MrLeggo
I have made <0 posts
I have made <0 posts
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2021 11:16 am
2
Full Name: Alex Legg
Company Details: Cloned Reality
Company Position Title: Senior Developer
Country: New Zealand
Linkedin Profile: Yes
Has thanked: 7 times

Re: Admissibility of LiDAR in the Courts today

Post by MrLeggo »

3DForensics wrote: Thu Sep 27, 2018 2:20 am I would also recommend the IAFSM as a good resource. Early on, we kept a list of cases where the laser scanner was used in court. This is no longer necessary as there are hundreds of cases now and "the horse is out of the barn". Laser scanning is no longer a new thing to the court systems in Europe, Canada and the US. It has also been introduced in Australia, New Zealand and other countries.
Eugene, sorry to resurrect an old post! I've been scouring the internet for over a week but have found very few companies offering scanning in court and none in Aus/NZ (the recent webinar from Fat Pencil Studio was awesome though).

Would you happen to know of any resources with info on these companies? Or just suggest some well know ones.

I'm tempted to join IAFSM, do they still have lists?

Cheers,

Alex
User avatar
3DForensics
Honorary Member
Honorary Member
Posts: 1979
Joined: Mon Aug 03, 2009 1:52 am
14
Full Name: Eugene Liscio
Company Details: AI2-3D Forensics
Company Position Title: Owner
Skype Name: eliscio
Location: Toronto, Canada
Has thanked: 13 times
Been thanked: 70 times
Contact:

Re: Admissibility of LiDAR in the Courts today

Post by 3DForensics »

Hi Alex,

I think the issue is that laser scanning and photogrammetry are quite common now in North America and so we stopped keeping the IAFSM list up to date. I know that it still exists and is there, but the case references are older now.

Other than contacting some of the company representatives themselves, i am not sure there is a lot online with respect to case admissibility.

And yes, you should consider the IAFSM, but not for just the list. It has a good network of people working in the area of 3D and forensics and we have an incredible conference scheduled for February in Denver with a mass casualty exercise done in a large arena with actors, police and a lot of participants.

Hope to see you there!

Eugene
User avatar
Mike Annear
V.I.P Member
V.I.P Member
Posts: 800
Joined: Mon Jun 08, 2009 5:45 am
14
Full Name: Mike Annear
Company Details: The Yard Brisbane
Company Position Title: Manager - 3D Design and Scanning
Country: Australia
Linkedin Profile: Yes
Location: Hemmant, Queensland, Australia
Has thanked: 122 times
Been thanked: 196 times
Contact:

Re: Admissibility of LiDAR in the Courts today

Post by Mike Annear »

I was involved in generating Courtroom graphics from scan data back in the 2000's,
I was working for TRL UK /Australia.
Contact Paul Hiller from ARRB (https://www.arrb.com.au )
or a crash investigator called Grant Johnston in Sydney , they are both involved in laser scanning for forensics.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Mike Annear
www.mikeannear.com
QLD, Australia.
MrLeggo
I have made <0 posts
I have made <0 posts
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2021 11:16 am
2
Full Name: Alex Legg
Company Details: Cloned Reality
Company Position Title: Senior Developer
Country: New Zealand
Linkedin Profile: Yes
Has thanked: 7 times

Re: Admissibility of LiDAR in the Courts today

Post by MrLeggo »

Thank you Eugene, that was what I was starting to suspect. And yes, I was reading about upcoming conference, it looks great. Not sure I'll be able to get back into NZ easily though! Hopefully it will be shown online too.

Mike, thank you so much for your generosity sharing those images and recommendations of people to follow-up with.
Post Reply

Return to “General Chat”