BLK360 wifi issues and a general pfffffttt! to leica

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Re: BLK360 wifi issues and a general pfffffttt! to leica

Post by gsisman »

jamesworrell wrote: Tue Feb 27, 2018 11:41 pm Yep have looked at Revo ..

I guess I see all these rave reviews, the videos doing cloud-to-cloud auto align regos in 360 etc - and I just can't seem to make it work as easily as I had hoped.

I see other surveyors on Instagram showing them doing warehouses and steel trusses etc and I think "are you f#@#$ing mad?"

So I started wondering what am I doing wrong?

We have had some success, but that was with black and white targets up for example .. and then the little things start to creep in - it can't see C10 targets which was a real shame and a surprise, the early bugs in Cyclone cost us time, the downloader now is great to have .. so the "ecosystem" is improving - but given the thing was announced like 2 years ago, some of this stuff should have been well sorted .. like I tried to do a rego in Recap the other day, it can't import *.blk files yet - had to suck in to cyclone and did e57's out only to find Recap needed ptg .. take 2 .. every time I turn around I hit these little walls and it only adds to my frustration. Even thermal, HDR .. not working out of the box .. the experience was not up to the level I am used to from Leica to be brutal.

I am sure we will get there - but I had higher expectations.
This is what happens when the big cheeses have a release date, but the product isn't ready.
Same thing happens in the first version of all software now. It is the Final Beta version not the final version. The final version that should be released is the Service Pack 1 (or SP2) They have us by the short-hairs. In lost time and money it makes up that difference between the next best thing.
I agree that the technology is AMAZING, you can't expect the same quality at that Price difference jump, but don't claim something it can't do when you start delivering it. It can't fully work as a quality scanning machine without Leica's software- plain and simple. The ReCAP gymnastics and performance doesn't live up to the potential of the hardware/data they are trying to load into it. The loss of confidence in the quality and service of the products that Leica puts out gets whittled down little by little, day by frustrating day.
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Re: BLK360 wifi issues and a general pfffffttt! to leica

Post by jamesworrell »

A simple example .. I did a job a couple of weeks ago with it. Was enthusiastic about doing a lease survey, internal, external .. bit of street. Wanting to champion the thing in our business and the workflow for slightly more complicated lease surveys - ie not a simple square retail shop - was keen to go.

Fired up the brand new Data Manager .. set the scan settings I wanted - headed out to the job, sans iPad.

Was expecting medium scans - so ~3 1/2 mins .. thing was ripping through in like 2 .. and I was certain I set it right .. wtf? This thing is doing low-res.

We double checked it yesterday and sure enough settings aren't be applied.

Now I see the Data Manager 1.4.2 (currenlty downloading) fixes a bug that wasn't setting the thing right. I mean .. is it tested at all?

I wrote software for a living for nearly 20+ years, accounting, payment systems, document control, etc - the last system supported several thousand entities and details on tens of thousands of users - about a million lines of code for 1-2 developers .. so I get it .. I know their frustrations .. but "when it has to be right" .. I'd rather it be right and late.

And sure - maybe I should have tested myself before going out in the field .. but am used to better experience as mentioned earlier and I am not paid to be a beta tester. Just one more frustration.
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Re: BLK360 wifi issues and a general pfffffttt! to leica

Post by Oatfedgoat »

jamesworrell wrote: Wed Feb 28, 2018 10:59 pm
.. I'd rather it be right and late.
Great sentiment that I am sure everyone here would agree with.
Users care less for proposed launch dates and more for an out of the box fit for purpose tool, how ever tight and improbable they are for a product team to hit.

BUT, we should not forget how much frustration was voiced on here at the delay of availability of it and how we collectively probably contributed to release pressures.
If it had not been pre-ordered and customers paid money in advance it would be far more likely to have been delayed further but tested more thoroughly.

Lessons for all to be learnt hopefully that are not repeated in the future, for the sake of my health, I won't hold my breath though!
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Re: BLK360 wifi issues and a general pfffffttt! to leica

Post by dhirota »

dhirota wrote: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:26 pm
pburrows145 wrote: Wed Dec 06, 2017 4:22 pm
Matt Young wrote: Wed Dec 06, 2017 1:58 pm Wait... it has a USB port and it's not even activated! Just when will this scanner be finished :x
It does not have a USB port. It has a diagnostic port which is covered over. Just wanted to clarify.
A quote from an email that I received
"This is an internal USB C port which can only be used in production and service."
This was from a year ago. I just spoke with a high profile geospatial friend today who has a BLK360. He will be looking into the usb-c port on the BLK360. Almost everything moving data and power today has a usb-c port, so it should be interesting.
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Re: BLK360 wifi issues and a general pfffffttt! to leica

Post by gsisman »

dhirota wrote: Fri Dec 14, 2018 12:25 am
dhirota wrote: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:26 pm
pburrows145 wrote: Wed Dec 06, 2017 4:22 pm

It does not have a USB port. It has a diagnostic port which is covered over. Just wanted to clarify.
A quote from an email that I received
"This is an internal USB C port which can only be used in production and service."
This was from a year ago. I just spoke with a high profile geospatial friend today who has a BLK360. He will be looking into the usb-c port on the BLK360. Almost everything moving data and power today has a usb-c port, so it should be interesting.
That would be great Dennis! As the wifi technology in the BLK is about 10 years old-whenever "N" came out. However we had tried several newer Wifi Cards for desktops with newer AC and supposedly compatible with N and they didn't work -so I believe they are running on "G" or "B"
I'd even send mine back for a paid engineered upgrade to AC standards
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Re: BLK360 wifi issues and a general pfffffttt! to leica

Post by dhirota »

Here is the best deal for a usb-c to usb-a cable that I have found for all the listed functions including data transfer and power for a number of platforms and devices, including 6 Android cameras, phones, tablets; new Red Hydrogen One; Ubuntu laptop with 4TB of NVME storage; and the rest of W10 stuff around the office.

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Re: BLK360 wifi issues and a general pfffffttt! to leica

Post by jezlong »

Hello all, ive looked on this forum before for advice but I literally only posted some stuff the other day. I use our blk all the time. this usbC port would solve all sorts of problems! I could actually forget the wifi ( which recently has been dropping out ) and also would be able to leave the blk downloading overnight instead of constantly changing the battery till I have all my scans off. I waste so much time! difficult to explain to the boss who doesn't use it at all. IF ANYONE GET THIS USBC PORT WORKING PLEASE LET US KNOW! can I suggest we start a separate topic on the subject so it gets more views....is this the way it works on here.

Jez.
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Re: BLK360 wifi issues and a general pfffffttt! to leica

Post by dhirota »

There are many threads on the LSF that deal with the BLK360 and its WiFi connection to a registration platform.

It is my belief that Leica GS selected many of the BLK360 design parameters based on where they were placing this scanner in their product line: at the bottom, based on price, to attract more users into the market place. They accomplished that. We all find that one of the major limitations of the BLK360 is using 2.4GHz WiFi to transfer data from the sensor to the registration platform. I am not sure of the exact problems of the many examples offered on the threads of the LSF, but I am offering one reason why this might be happening besides firmware and software.

12-16-2018 10-45-06 AM.jpg

This listing of approximately 50 2.4GHz Wifi systems, active and dead, surrounding my office illustrate the possible WiFi congestion within the 2.4GHz frequency depending on location. One of the worst locations to operate a device at 2.4GHz is at or near a hospital or an exhibition where there might be several thousand at that frequency. We run all of our WiFi devices at 5GHz and check the channels so nothing is even close.

The major problem with the BLK360 is that it selects the 2.4GHz channel (1-11) when you turn on the power and you cannot change the channel (I do not know how) to escape crowding from other devices nearby.

One alternative is to use a Faraday cage that we used in our labs when I was at the USAF Weapons Laboratory to protect against nuclear and solar EMP. You could build a small wire mesh box to fit a laptop and BLK360 to screen out other neighboring WiFi if that might help.
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Re: BLK360 wifi issues and a general pfffffttt! to leica

Post by Scott »

dhirota wrote: Sun Dec 16, 2018 9:29 pm There are many threads on the LSF that deal with the BLK360 and its WiFi connection to a registration platform.

It is my belief that Leica GS selected many of the BLK360 design parameters based on where they were placing this scanner in their product line: at the bottom, based on price, to attract more users into the market place. They accomplished that. We all find that one of the major limitations of the BLK360 is using 2.4GHz WiFi to transfer data from the sensor to the registration platform. I am not sure of the exact problems of the many examples offered on the threads of the LSF, but I am offering one reason why this might be happening besides firmware and software.
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Re: BLK360 wifi issues and a general pfffffttt! to leica

Post by gsisman »

dhirota wrote: Sun Dec 16, 2018 9:29 pm There are many threads on the LSF that deal with the BLK360 and its WiFi connection to a registration platform.

It is my belief that Leica GS selected many of the BLK360 design parameters based on where they were placing this scanner in their product line: at the bottom, based on price, to attract more users into the market place. They accomplished that. We all find that one of the major limitations of the BLK360 is using 2.4GHz WiFi to transfer data from the sensor to the registration platform. I am not sure of the exact problems of the many examples offered on the threads of the LSF, but I am offering one reason why this might be happening besides firmware and software.


12-16-2018 10-45-06 AM.jpg


This listing of approximately 50 2.4GHz Wifi systems, active and dead, surrounding my office illustrate the possible WiFi congestion within the 2.4GHz frequency depending on location. One of the worst locations to operate a device at 2.4GHz is at or near a hospital or an exhibition where there might be several thousand at that frequency. We run all of our WiFi devices at 5GHz and check the channels so nothing is even close.

The major problem with the BLK360 is that it selects the 2.4GHz channel (1-11) when you turn on the power and you cannot change the channel (I do not know how) to escape crowding from other devices nearby.

One alternative is to use a Faraday cage that we used in our labs when I was at the USAF Weapons Laboratory to protect against nuclear and solar EMP. You could build a small wire mesh box to fit a laptop and BLK360 to screen out other neighboring WiFi if that might help.
Dennis

You are absolutely right in it being it's placement in their product lines. You can tell that by where it is basically sold and supported within their sales channels -Leica Lasers and E-Products-not HDS..

With the RTC360 (Seemingly an HDS product) coming out so soon after the BLK, you gotta know they had that in mind. That being said the basic functionality of data transfer is not going to cause crossover- it's the quality and range of the scans. It's another tool that for the high powered HDS user or production work is a fill in tool. My message to Leica is Don't hamper data transfer as an option in your selling marketing scheme. It's basic functionality and to use it as a playing card either now or later is a cheap trick.
Word through the grapevine is that the BLK very soon will be able to link to the Field 360 app. (My guess that delay is due to contract issues with Autodesk per Recap Mobile.

The downside is that transferring the entire cloud (BLK) vs. a parsed sample (as per the RTC360) in order to do the visual on-pad Registration) is going to once again run into the slow WIFI issue -unless they have some 5GHZ or better (IPAD Pro inbuilt) WIFI locked down inside the BLK that they will release. But probably that will be introduced in NEXT YEARS BLK hardware. Previous buyers....-Welcome to "Bug-on-the-windshield" world. You can buy a NEW one.
Leica has always under-estimated the actual market for purchasing their items if they would just get the features correct the first time. The volume vs. price point issue. All these issues have only hampered their sales in BLK's in my opinion and turned some people to other brands in the interim- unable to make the alternate leap..... "Oh shoot I'm just going to bag the $25k BLK and jump to the $75k RTC!"
Now to send my BLK back to switzerland for a recal after a field incident being knocked over against and opeing door on it's very small and lightweight tripod and hitting it's noggin mis-aligning the photos..
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