BLK360 - Help with black surfaces

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MSE
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BLK360 - Help with black surfaces

Post by MSE » Sat Sep 16, 2017 8:39 am

Based on my preliminary tests, the BLK 360 does not capture ANY point data for black surfaces. This is a step back. Are there any settings that can be adjusted to help? Is it wishful thinking to expect that this can be corrected with a firmware update? I'd be curious to know how many other are experiencing similar issues.

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Re: BLK360 - Help with black surfaces

Post by dhirota » Sat Sep 16, 2017 11:01 am

Here are my examples of scanning black surfaces with the BLK360

https://www.laserscanningforum.com/foru ... 0&start=70

The BLK360 manual specifically describes black surfaces as potential problems.
Dennis Hirota, PhD, PE, LPLS
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Re: BLK360 - Help with black surfaces

Post by Lightpoint » Mon Sep 18, 2017 5:48 am

I've heard, through the grapevine, that you're not the only one experiencing this.

I'm still waiting to see some black vehicle scans, but expect I'll have those in-hand by the week's end (thanks to the generosity of current owners). I'll post up once I get them, along with permission to share.

Issues with black is expected considering the short wavelength (830 nm), but entirely missing black would be somewhat surprising. The Faro S120 (905 nm) gets black okaaaaaay...unless it's clean and shiny (in my experience with vehicles).

Lou

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Re: BLK360 - Help with black surfaces

Post by Formula1982 » Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:47 am

Although most here will already know this, but it's worth noting...

Many scanners struggle with black surfaces. Depending on the laser colour, some other colours will produce little/no return also.
For example, we've always known that the green laser scanners hate both black and dark red surfaces. So scanning a boat hull for example, as we found when scanning some vessel decks can lead the the boat looking like the entire hull has been removed except the windows when looking at the data! Luckly in this example, the hull was not required!

So for a scanner that costs so little, and considering that many much more expensive scanners either have a low or no return from black surfaces, I wouldn't say it's a step back.
I wouldn't expect a 'consumer grade' scanner that costs a fraction of a 'professional grade' scanner will operate to the same level.

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Re: BLK360 - Help with black surfaces

Post by MSE » Mon Sep 18, 2017 7:36 pm

Attached are screen captures of data captured this morning with the BLK360. It was not raining, but the ground surface was wet. While I am well aware of the reflectivity issues created with wet surfaces, I was surprised to see that the BLK did not capture any of the parking lot surface (except for the painted white lines). I also got very little return on the vehicles. I know this is not a $100k+ scanner, but my experience with the cheapest FARO units has been night-and-day better. I am curious if I am doing something wrong. Are there any Leica people that can help and/or provide a tech support number? Thank you.
BLK-RV1.jpg
BLK-3D1.jpg
BLK-RV2.jpg
BLK-3D2.jpg
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Re: BLK360 - Help with black surfaces

Post by blazaj » Tue Sep 19, 2017 7:35 am

No data at all? Maybe filtered out on import? Can you download and check raw scans?

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Re: BLK360 - Help with black surfaces

Post by 3DForensics » Wed Sep 20, 2017 2:12 pm

Can you tell me something about the amount of water on the surface of the asphalt? I am not so surprised by the black vehicle but I am curious about how wet the surface of an object needs to be before the scanner gets no return signal. Does anyone know what the power output of the laser is?

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Re: BLK360 - Help with black surfaces

Post by stevehaycock » Wed Sep 20, 2017 5:04 pm

3DForensics wrote:
Wed Sep 20, 2017 2:12 pm
Does anyone know what the power output of the laser is?
The wavelength is 830nm

https://lasers.leica-geosystems.com/sit ... _sheet.pdf

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Re: BLK360 - Help with black surfaces

Post by 3DForensics » Wed Sep 20, 2017 5:40 pm

power output in mW...not listed on spec sheet but there should be a notice somewhere. Could also have something to do with 830 nm but my guess is that the 1550 nm scanners are more sensitive to moisture (at least from my tests).

Eugene

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Re: BLK360 - Help with black surfaces

Post by tbwester » Wed Sep 20, 2017 6:50 pm

have you tried bringing the data straight into cyclone. importing directly from the BLK over wifi?

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